Talk about Talks! Readers Speak Up on Speeches
Compiled and edited by Kathy Green

Seventy Times Seven and Counting

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The Seven Deadly Sins of Sacrament Meeting Talks, by Christian A. Johnson

The article was terrific.  We will print up copies and hand them out to our speakers in advance.

Chuckle and cringe: Three weeks ago, our concluding speaker quoted all verses of a Michael Jackson song and said that he must have been inspired when he wrote it.

Brother B from California

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As a High Councilor, I would like to add a few other sins:

1. The Sin of Being Boring.  I was encouraged by my Stake President not to be boring.  Good advice!  I try to add appropriate personal stories to make my talks more interesting.

2. The Sin of Multiple Testimonies.  Some speakers will bear their testimony in the middle of the talk, giving you the false impress of that they are wrapping up when they are actually gaining steam.

3. The Sin of Clock Watching.  This is related to your Sin of Unpreparedness.  This is when the speakers constantly are looking at the clock as if they are really going to keep to their time.

4. The Sin of False Witness.  This is when the speaker says, "This is going to be a quick talk" or that he will only take a few minutes but end up taking a half an hour.

5. The Sin of Overscheduling.  This is committed by the bishopric, who schedule five speakers and a musical number expecting that the meeting will still end on time.

6.  The Sin of Disobedience.  This is when the time has basically expired and the last speaker is asked to bear his testimony for the sake of time.  However the speaker gives his talk anyway.

7. The Sin of the Pointless Story.  This is when the speaker tells a personal story that really doesn't fit the topic or clearly illustrate a gospel principle.  Sometimes this is a personal experience that only a few people on the ward will relate to because they know the background.

8. The Sin of Calling Someone from the Congregation.  I have actually been guilty of this once.  This is when you call on some unsuspecting person from the congregation to make a comment or bear testimony to emphasize a point.  Rarely does this work out, most of the time the unprepared saint is just as unprepared as you and it falls short of the mark.  This is also very closely related to the Sin of Unpreparedness.  Since this could potentially work if you did prepare.

9. The Sin of Making an Acceptance Speech.  This mostly happens when someone in a leadership position gives a talk.  They feel it is their time to thank everyone individually for their contribution and tell a little story about them.  Often they leave someone out or give someone a little too much credit, which offends someone.  Better to write a thank you note.

10. The Sin of Volume.  This is when the speaker is under the impression that their voice is so loud that they don't need to use the microphone, not realizing that even the loudest of speakers cannot project past the 4th row or even past the crying baby on the 2nd row.

And my favorite: 11. The Sin of the Unplanned Speaker.  This is when the bishop or the person conducting decided to put themselves on the agenda by giving their commentary about what the talks are going to be about or what the talks were about.  This would be fine if it was a minute or two but most of the time this is another 15 minute talk in itself.  This could also be called the Sin of Stealing the Thunder.  I have seen an instance where the bishop’s commentary was so long that the actual speaker had to forgo giving his talk!

Maybe we should write a book!

Paul

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I thoroughly agree with your list, and the many additions others made.  I pray, though, that we will be charitable as we listen to each other. Surely God can touch and teach each of us as we strive to get the most out of each speaker — no matter how fumbling their attempts.  I learned this once as my ward and I squirmed through an awful sacrament meeting talk.  I found myself praying that the Lord would inspire the speaker to sit down.  I received an immediate and clear chastisement:

1)  I was not to use  prayer for my personal comfort over this brother's need to experience and  learn — even if it meant learning how NOT to do something;

2)  I needed  charity desperately.

What power for good could be accomplished if that whole congregation was offering earnest prayers in the speaker's behalf, instead of thinking of their need to hear a better talk.  Our combined charity could have called down inspiration on his head, that maybe he didn't know how to ask for.  He would have felt the Spirit, he would have learned something about appropriately speaking from the pulpit.  His fear and lack of experience limited him; our limited charity cut off a great opportunity.  Years later I heard a similarly painful talk from a young lady. This time, you could feel the whole congregation pulling for her, and praying for her to succeed.  We got to witness the Spirit enter her, calm her, teach her, and loosen her tongue.  It was worth the struggle. 

In our efforts to improve, may we be patient and loving with each other. Great good can flow in both directions.

Kathleen Lewis
Minnetonka, MN

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Great article.  Unfortunately, those who need this the most will probably not read it or if they do read it will figure that it does not apply to them.

Judy Leiser
Newport, Washington

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Are we murmuring here?

I think the deadliest sin is when a person is critiquing a talk while it is being delivered rather than listening with the spirit or praying for the spirit.  If we find ourselves bored or irritated or unimpressed or particularly squeamish, do we then say a prayer to our Savior to lift up and guide the speaker? 

Do we pray for ourselves to find the spirit in the matter?  Sometimes when I, myself, am digging deep to enjoy a very long and monotonous reading from a thirteen-year-old, I find myself smiling simply because they are adding to their spirit and I chuckle to think how many more talks they will give in a lifetime.  I pray for their nervousness to be relieved.  I pray that they will feel their Savior's love while they stand and preach for Him.  I am complimented often on the talks I have given; my first thought is gratitude for the gift.  It is a gift to preach the gospel, and not everyone has it.  Pray for those who are working on it on with whatever capacity they have. 

In small congregations when talks rotate through the membership quickly, I am always sad that there are sweet and spiritual folk who say no to the invitation to speak in sacrament.  Many are truly afraid to do so. Many don't feel they measure up.  I truly don't expect sacrament meeting to be the same caliber as our general conference.  I do expect to maintain the spirit I received during the sacrament. 

How sad if we are too quick to lose it because speakers aren't up to snuff.

Presently, I am so far distant from a chapel, that when I am able to attend I am indeed grateful for all I receive during sacrament, polished or not. The prophet Joseph was not a great preacher; he often relied on Sidney Rigdon for that.  Sidney was more educated and eloquent.  Joseph spoke well when it was Heavenly Father speaking through him.

Amanda Joubert
Big Bend National Park,Texas

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I really enjoyed this article on the "Seven Deadly Sins of Sacrament Meeting Talks." I heartily agree with his message. I think an 8th "SIN" would be failing to end one's talk with his testimony. When I was a young girl in Junior High, probably 8th grade, I was asked to speak in stake conference by my stake president. My dear friend and Stake President gave me some tips for the talk.  He even had me give the talk to him in advance. President Packard wanted to share his thoughts and comments and "critique" my message. He gave me several important tips that I still remember. One of the tips that he gave me that I really appreciated and have incorporated in every talk since that time more than 35 years ago was to end every talk with my testimony.  I believe that other General Authorities have also admonished us to follow that practice of ending our talks with our testimony.

Lois Wharton
Cedar Park, Texas

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The article on Sacrament Meeting talks is so relevant and true!  I agreed with each of the listing of the Seven Sins!

My only comment on Sacrament meeting talks is that sometime you never get ASKED to speak. I would love to be able to speak in Sacrament meeting once again. It has probably been 10 years since I was asked to speak. And as I am now 78 years old and partially crippled, I guess they think I cannot talk either.

Sometimes the same people are asked to speak over and over; and the older folks in the wards are never given the opportunity. I can surely watch the clock and would never take over someone else’s time, and I do prepare and rehearse so that my time is correct.  Why don't the leaders give some of us oldsters a chance to speak as well as all the youth and young adult people?

Just a thought.

I love the Church, and the gospel. It is my life, and I have lived a lot of wonderful experiences in my time, having been on a mission and sending all my children on missions, and traveling to many countries and finding the Church in off the road places around the world. I think it would be lovely to be able to share my testimony some time in Sacrament meeting. Just ask me!

Thank you for your wonderful magazine, and all the great articles and stories.  I love it! 

Bonnie Jean Petersen
Salt Lake City, Utah

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I think that this is a great article. I’d like to propose the eighth and ninth deadly sins of giving a talk in sacrament meeting.

The Eighth Deadly Sin — Plagiarism. Webster’s New World Dictionary, Third College Edition describes plagiarizing as "taking ideas and writings from another and passing them off as one’s own." I know that this happens in my own ward, not only in sacrament meeting talks but also in Relief Society and Priesthood Newsletters. I’ve looked up topics that I had further interest in and found to my dismay that at times, large portions of the talks or writings in the newsletters have been taken directly from other talks — many from talks of general authorities — and not cited. I’m sure that no one means to steal, but plagiarism isn’t something we talk about in church.

The Ninth Deadly Sin —Lack of Focus on Jesus Christ. For many years, the majority of the yearly topics in sacrament meeting in our ward have covered food storage, preparedness, genealogy, missionary work, Book of Mormon, Joseph Smith, mothers, teaching the children, temples, heritage, prayer, covenants, testimony, etc. Little or no mention of Jesus Christ is made during the talk until the end with the obligatory, “I say these things in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.” I believe that while all these gospel topics are important, more important is how they lead us back to Christ, His teachings and salvation.

We have classes on many different topics in the Church. I think that we’d all benefit from some instruction in giving talks too.

Jane Brazelton
West Milton, Ohio

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A copy of this article will be placed by the agendas for each High Council member to pick up prior to our next High Council meeting.  What a great little article to let the High Council know that they need to follow certain guidelines to be a good speaker.  I have committed all of these sins in my service in the Lord’s kingdom.  Hopefully they were done when I was a young man.  Once again, a quality article from Meridian Magazine.

Greg Glenn
Calgary Alberta Stake

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Regarding "The Seven Deadly Sins of Sacrament Meeting Talks," time theft is especially upsetting when we are anticipating talks from returned missionaries.  Even though there are no longer "homecoming" Sacrament Meetings, many members look forward to listening to strong testimonies and appropriately shared mission experiences from someone who so recently has had that wonderful mantle — and feel disappointed if only a little time is left to hear these.

Linda Grover
Orem, Utah

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High councilors can play a vital role in helping members to have a restful Sabbath. Paul was the first high council speaker. Heed an account of one of his better speeches: “And there sat in a window a certain young man named Eutychus, being fallen into a deep sleep: and as Paul was long preaching, he sunk down with sleep, and fell down from the third loft, and was taken up dead.” (Acts 20:9).

High councilors should magnify their callings by striving to follow Paul’s example. Current church policy prohibits members of the congregation from sitting in windowsills during meetings. Furthermore, nearly all meeting houses in North America are equipped with padded pews and thus falling asleep during meetings is a safe way to spend the Sabbath.

Techniques: The following are timeless techniques that have been employed by high council speakers for this entire dispensation to help members sleep during sacrament meeting.

·  Begin at the beginning. A catchy story, a thought-provoking quote, or a funny joke are all counterproductive openers. If you want to lull the congregation, you’ve got to do it from the very start. Try starting with a tepid comment about the choir or a rote expression of “love and concern” from the stake presidency — whether they have asked you to deliver their regards or not.

·  Apologize. It is going to be a bad talk, so start right up front with the excuses. People should know they should do something more valuable with their time — like snooze, read their scriptures, or read the bulletin boards out in the foyer.

·  Mumble. Clear words are more attention grabbing — try not to distract members of the congregation from the important things that they have found to do during your time at the podium. Make sure that what you say flows together as one complete whole — you do not want to awaken anyone.

·  Monotone. Altering your voice to match the emotion of the topic is inappropriate for the reverent occasion of sacrament meeting. The scriptures clearly teach that our Heavenly Father is an unchanging being: "God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, and in him there is no variableness neither shadow of changing... he changeth not; if so he would cease to be God” (Mormon 9:9, 19). Speakers are to follow His example by not changing the tone of their voice during a talk.

·  Quote. Quote the scriptures, general authorities, popular writers, songs, poems — whatever it takes — just quote. Quotations should be lengthy, without wasteful pauses or unnecessary commentary. They need not relate to the assigned topic.

·  Hands on the lectern. The church has gone to great expense to install lectern in all of the meeting houses around the world. On rental properties, difficult negotiations are undertaken to assure that a suitable lectern is available. Hands should firmly grip the respective sides of the provided equipment. The lectern is a modern ‘type’ of the iron rod, to which we are to “cling” and “continually hold fast” (1 Nephi 8:24, 30). It would be a great tragedy if a member of the congregation were nearly into some well-deserved Sabbath rest, and then was distracted to the front of the chapel by an expressive gesture. An important safety purpose is also served. When the speaker himself falls asleep, he is much less likely to fall and injure himself if he has a secure grasp of the lectern. Angels do not move their hands as a way of avoiding deception (DC 129:7). Furthermore, the scriptures speak about listening to the voice of the Lord. No mention is made of unnecessary hand gestures.

·  Style. There’s nothing natural about speaking in front of a congregation — so don’t make it sound natural. A great technique is to have your talk written out, word for word. Read it as if it were critically important — after all, High Councilmen are called by inspiration into their callings, so what they say from the pulpit should be regarded as scripture (DC 68:4).

·  Speaking by the Spirit. Truly celestial speakers follow the Lord’s command: “Take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost." (Mark 13:11). Preparation is like sin — the less the better. Some gems of oratory are hastily thrown together in the final few moments prior to their delivery.

·  Incoherence. The gentiles teach that a good talk has a catchy beginning, an explanation of the topic to be considered, a cogent exploration of ideas with concrete examples and real-life applications, and a powerful summary. The ways of the Church are higher than the ways of the world. Don’t be chained down by a conventional structure — just start droning. Talks with easily identified outlines are more difficult to ignore, and thus in opposition to the higher goal of the congregation having a restful Sabbath.

· Examples. Within Mormon oral history, there are many stories and quotes that serve to promote faith. Use such liberally. The facts of an incident do not need to be verifiable by extant documentation to be used from the pulpit.

· Humor. The Lord was certainly not joking around when He said: "not with much laughter, for this is sin," (DC 59:15) and "cast away your idle thoughts and your excess of laughter far from you." (DC 88:69) and furthermore: "Therefore, cease from all your light speeches, from all laughter" (DC 88:121). Enjoyable, thoughtfully worded stories are not welcome during the somber occasion of sacrament meeting.

· Wisdom and Order. The Church has divided up responsibilities for the varied work of the Church amongst different entities. Leave the missionary work to the experts. Say what you feel about other churches, they’re all of the devil anyway. Assume that the congregation knows all of the jargon and church culture, as well as the background and context of the scriptures. There is no need to condescendingly define terms primarily used within the Church. Sentences like: “It was a sweet experience when the Relief Society had enrichment night about the teachings for our time from the D&C at the stake center” are truly inspired.

Jesse Kincaid
Royal Oak, Michigan

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Breakfast at Tiffany’s

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The Race I Run, by Tiffany Lewis

As the father of five daughters — each married and having collectively given me six grandchildren under the age of three — I see Mother Mayhem as important as any column or feature in Meridian Magazine.

This is not simply the opinion of a justifiably proud father and grandfather; it is also the professional opinion of a practicing clinical psychologist with 25 years of observing and helping families, many LDS, many not. Mother Mayhem is more than an interesting and entertaining column; it is a ministry — a labor of love, insight, encouragement, and "electronic sisterhood" for the courageous LDS mothers — young and less-young — whose efforts are bringing forth happy and righteous human beings.

As such, these mothers are laying the very foundation of Zion. I will be sharing Sister Lewis' column with not only the mothers I see in counseling but with their husbands also, as well as with the women of my ward and stake.

When I discovered the column yesterday, I immediately e-mailed it to my daughters in Provo, Scottsdale, Ithaca, Tempe, and London. My eldest (a new, first-time mother) has already begun mining the Mother Mayhem archives. Today she e-mailed me back with her favorite find: "I Miss My Brain." http://www.meridianmagazine.com/mothermayhem/050608brain.html

On behalf of my daughters and myself, may I say "Bravo, Sister Lewis! And bravo Meridian Magazine!"

Ed D. Lauritsen, Ph.D.
Show Low, Arizona

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Tiffany's articles really hit home with me! I have three boys, too, all born during my husband's graduate school years, which thankfully now are OVER (the screen cannot convey the joy hidden in that word). I can so relate to the daily marathon running. It rejuvenates me somehow, just to hear someone articulate it so well.

Michelle Baker
Bryant, Arkansas

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The Spirit is Willing

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Seven Trumpets, by John P. Pratt

The listing of the seven Holy Angels — Raphael comes down and becomes Enoch — Cool!

In the Book of Enoch, translated by Richard Laurence, on pages 28/29 we have Raphael escorting Enoch through the spirits of the dead.  How could this be, unless Raphael's spirit still resides with Heavenly Father and the flesh and bones of Raphael resides on Earth?

This opens up many major questions.

Seeing that he uses the Enoch calendar to confirm this, where is the truth?  Can the spirit of Enoch (Raphael) guide the flesh of the living Enoch?  Interesting concept.

Thank you,

Bill Thomas
Hudson Falls, NY

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Between the Lines

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Bible Codes: A New Approach, by John P. Pratt

What an amazing, eye-opening discovery!  Brother Pratt's insights and research are mind-boggling.  Thank you for making me aware of this interesting aspect of the Bible.

Christina Sheldon
Logandale, Nevada

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I was fascinated to see an article on the "Bible Codes" in your magazine.  I have written three documentaries and a book on the Bible Codes and was fortunate enough to participate in the first annual Torah Code Symposium held at the King David Hotel in Jerusalem.  I have met and talked with Eliyahu Rips, the internationally acclaimed mathematician who developed the original codes research and several of his colleagues including Harold Gans, the former head of Cryptography for the NSA and the author of over 80 books (most of them classified) on cryptography. 

Dr. Gans, upon hearing of Rips’ work, assumed it was all hogwash — but being the world's leading expert on codes he decided to write his own program to demonstrate how silly it was.  Gans, a very tidy man, didn't use the linked CRAY computers that were available to him because he didn't want the Agency to be associated with something so obviously ridiculous, so he added additional requirements to the original study, and ran it on a standard IBM 386 in his home.  The computer ground away for 19 days and some odd hours before producing results that not only confirmed the original study but added a whole new dimension to it, something Rips enthusiastically encourages.  He actively invites researchers to attack his work and quickly embraces discoveries that demonstrate shortcomings in his calculations. (Those have been precious few and far between, by the way).  In short, the Gans program demonstrated, at least to his satisfaction, that the codes appearing by random chance was simply a statistical impossibility.

As Gans has pointed out many times, the critics of Rips work begin with the notion that, "It cannot be, therefore it isn't."  And instead of emulating the strict rules by which Rips constructed his study, they design their own methods, which are calculated to fail.  They excuse themselves by saying, well, Rips "could have" manipulated the data so why shouldn't we.

Dr. Pratt could have saved himself a great deal of time and trouble by going directly to the source.  Eliyahu Rips, even though he is a world class mathematician, is eminently approachable.  Harold Gans, now retired from his position with NSA, is likewise more than willing to talk with any serious scholar.  He is still the world's leading expert on cryptography, by the way.  But interestingly enough, it was a Rabbi, a survivor of the holocaust and a Talmudic prodigy, named Wiessmandl who, working with a pencil and paper in the late 1940's, made the first solid discovery that seemed to verify the ancient Jewish tradition  that says: "Everything that ever was or ever will be is included in the Torah."  Dr. Pratt labored mightily with this particular discovery in his article, which was simply that Torah appears in Genesis and Exodus at a skip of 50 letters, and again in Numbers and Deuteronomy at the same skip but in reverse.  What Dr. Pratt apparently missed and what Wiessmandl found was that in the book of Leviticus, at a skip of 7 letters is YHWH, or the name of God.  What you have then, is: TORH -> TORH --> YHWH <- HROT <-- HROT

or in perfect Chiastic order, the Torah always points to the name of God. (Or at least that was Wiessmandl's thought)

Dr. Pratt is mistaken when he suggests interest in the Bible Codes has flagged.  More rsearchers have now entered the field than ever before and the vast improvements in computer technology have opened the doors to the discovery of codes that are amazingly complex; not just words but entire sentences, and yes, they do frequently have reference to the surface text.

Dr. Rips told me he thought that all we were dealing with at this point was a crossword puzzle that ultimately the code will prove to be several dimensions deep.  That can only be possible if the Rabbinic tradition is true that holds that all 308,405 letters in the Torah were dictated by God to Moses, in precise sequence without spaces, punctuation, pages or paragraphs. Called "Scripta Continua," this Torah form has been found dating as late as the time of Ezra.  If Rips is right then another of the traditions might be verified.  This one says the entire history of the Jewish people can be found in Deuteronomy 32.

In any case, I was thrilled to see Dr. Pratt's column.  He at least takes an open and scholarly approach to the subject.  Most of the critics are still hung up on the same myopic opinion expressed by Dr. Maya bar Hillel (sic) to wit:  "It (the code) cannot possibly be valid.  That would mean that God wrote the Torah." 

Joe Meier
St. George, Utah

**

To spend a lifetime on codes, DNA, supposition, exposition, analysis, etc, really can take away from doing one’s duty and living by the scriptures.  All the outside stuff is very tiring and non-productive.

I don't mean that anyone should stick his head in a shell but one has to make sure the hours given to us are productive.  It would be better to take a bike ride or a hike with a grandchild than to waste time on many things.  I look back and realize I will suffer from a lack of words when at the bar all those hours wasted watching TV will be part of the life review.  I could spend hours trying to figure out what the "code" article is about and I'm sure that at the end I wouldn't know any more than I do now just by reading it though once and having my eyes glaze over.

I'm just pondering and sometimes have too much time on my hands.

Thomas D. Coppin MD
Utah

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Final Exam

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Going Down the Waterslide in God’s Embrace, by H. Wallace Goddard

It's hard to explain to people who are standing in the wrong place the reason for pain and suffering and Heavenly Father's (apparently) withholding his assistance. I have recently come to realize or articulate that this mortal "test" is not a test like a college exam. Heavenly Father doesn't just want us to "know" the answers. He wants them written on the fleshy tables of our hearts.

Todd Lillywhite
Murray, UT

Grand Slam

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Grandparenting with Complications, by Faye A. Klingler

Thanks for the articles on difficult grandparenting issues.  It's good to know we're not alone, and I appreciate the thoughtful suggestions to give us hope.

Ann-Marie Jensen
Chicago, Illinois

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A Real Find

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Finding Nephi’s Bountiful in the Real World, by Warren P. Aston

I found the article very interesting.  Thanks for sharing with your readers.

Richard E. Turley, Sr.
Salt Lake City, Utah

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Head Over Heels

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Turning Freud Upside Down, by Aaron P. Jackson and Lane Fischer

Interesting article.  As a family physician, I'm more often than not the only mental health provider that my patients see.  They're either too busy to see a psychologist/social worker, or just aren't interested. 

My training emphasized embracing the "bio/psycho/social model."  I always ask my depressed/anxious patients about their sources of support, including their church and religious beliefs.  If they want to explore that aspect of their lives together we do.  I often talk to my patients about issues of guilt and hopelessness.  Although I'm not trained in cognitive behavioral therapy, my open approach, accompanied with appropriate antidepressants, are usually helpful.

Scott Bishop, MD
Hill Air Force Base, Utah

**

Personally, I wonder why most psychologists and psychiatrists don't consider a very basic question: What is the belief system of the person they are working with?  To just give a blanket statement, they are LDS or not LDS is too simple.  I am talking about the client, not the psychologist.  Within our church there is a wide range of belief systems and understanding. 

Often times, a psychologist will presume that because a person is LDS, they adhere to a certain belief system, which I have found in working with people, is simply not true.  If more professionals would stop and find out what the person wants, what he or she believes is possible, and what role the person feels that the professional should play, there might be more "cures" and less exploring issues that have nothing to do with the problem. 

Of course, that is my belief system. Anyway, it doesn't matter the religious belief of the individual if the professional takes time to learn what it is (not just the label Protestant, Catholic, Mormon, or atheist) and work within the particular belief system of that individual.   That seems to me to be a more ethical way.

Catherine Hanson
Riverside, California  

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I like the article on “Turning Freud Upside-Down” very much.  I am pleased to see some LDS counselors at last coming out and saying what many others have been thinking.  Unfortunately it seems that having the degree is what counts most and looking very professional, even though many counselors cannot relate to their clients’ needs.  I and others have left classes as a result of professors and teachers pushing their own agenda rather than working to turn out well educated men and women in the fields of psychotherapy. One incident that I particularly remember is when a woman about 26 came to lecture us on sexual assault, or rape.  The lecture was nothing more than a biology lesson, up close and personal.  There were a few rape survivors in the class and this certainly didn't help them. I went to see the principal and ask him to get us lecturers who lectured on subjects pertinent to counseling

So did two of the women, one of whom had been raped and was visibly upset. The principal said we were prudes and would never make counselors. He lost eight students that day as a result of his attitude. I have no problems finding clients from both church and non church backgrounds, and many are female rape victims.  So much for the principal’s prediction.  The college went broke a few years later. The Adelaide University had a real anti Christian attitude in its counseling and psychology courses and some LDS students could not stay there because it cut right across their beliefs. I have a lifetime of experience as well as study.  My clients prefer my way of counseling because it takes into account their feelings and I allow as much time as they need. I attended a meeting of church counselors in Australia some years ago at the invitation another older and very experienced counselor.

I have done years of voluntary work and worked with other volunteers.  One of the best counselors in our organization was a former biker woman. There she was, skinny and tattooed and looking tough. She was tough. Please note, I said tough, not rough.  This woman learned from her hard life in the bike gangs and got good results where the official government psychologists could not.  She is now a qualified psychologist and she says Freud and several others were simply egoists who had no idea of reality.

I agree wholeheartedly.  No one knows the job as well as the man on the factory floor. There is no room for elitism or intellectual snobbery here. People have their own problems and no one can know how to solve them all.  No degree gives that power.

Gary Powell
Palmwoods QLD
Australia

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Genesis Nemesis